“We need to stop packing more and more content into degree programmes”

Andreas Vaterlaus and Lorenz Hurni, how has your view of ETH been changed by your roles as Vice Rector?

Vaterlaus: You learn how complex the processes really are. Before, for example, I thought exceptions were much easier to make (laughs), but from the rectorate's point of view, they paralyse the system.

Hurni: I have a really better understanding of ETH. I can see why which cog turns where it does and why it is needed. And I’ve learnt where I can exert an impact myself.

And where have you done this?

Hurni: My job had two parts, so to speak – an obligatory and a voluntary part. The obligatory part included many regulatory processes, including disciplinary ones. That’s not something anyone likes doing, but simply part of the job. I also tried to turn the little cogs and simplify things where I could – such as with the complaints procedure.

And the voluntary part – what particularly pleased you?

Hurni: Awarding the Excellence Scholarship & Opportunity Programme (ESOP) scholarships was very satisfying. There is an excellent range of applicants and the students with these scholarships also go on to perform very well. Many remain to complete a doctorate. This is truly well invested money for science and society.

Vaterlaus: For me it is the projects we have been able to support with the Innovedum fund. It gives me pleasure to see how committed the lecturers are in developing new forms of teaching. This applies even more to degree programme initiative. The creation of good new or revised degree programmes benefits so many students.

What challenges is teaching at ETH facing?

Vaterlaus: We need to stop constantly packing more content into degree programmes. If you ask lecturers what needs changing, they generally make suggestions for more content. And the focus is mostly on individual or small numbers of courses. We ought much more frequently to take a couple of steps back, consider degrees as a whole and ask ourselves what really sets graduates of a degree programme apart and what skills they ought to have. This would help to slim down overloaded programmes.

Andreas Vaterlaus, your Vice Rector title included the word “development”. Where do changes at ETH have their origin?

They generally take place quite simply because there is a need for them, such as when we split the first-year examination for certain subjects into two so that students would receive feedback on their level earlier. I think ETH is good at responding to the needs of both students and lecturers. Sometimes almost too good, which results in regulation landscapes with complex special cases. However, there is also sometimes simply pressure to reform because regulations no longer reflect reality. This was the case with the abolition of the course attendance confirmation.

Which trends do you see, Lorenz Hurni?

Hurni: Things have also not got simpler in my area as Vice Rector for Study Programmes: complaints and legal cases in particular are becoming more difficult and juristic because the parties consult a lawyer more quickly today than they used to. This is sometimes disillusioning. The work has also become more arduous due to the fact that the number of students has grown so fast. It is also clear to me as Vice Rector for Study Programmes how complex our examination system is.

How is this apparent?

There are so many types of examination and continuous performance assessment at ETH that mistakes occur more quickly, such as when continuous performance assessment is weighted with the wrong percentage. It is therefore good and important that we wish to simplify the examination system and are now addressing this in coordination with improved control of student growth.

In your roles as Vice Rector, you saw the need for simplification and standardisation. At the same time, you are aware as representatives of your departments of the need for specialisation and diversity at ETH. How can this be reconciled?

Hurni: With precisely the roles we had as Vice Rectors. I always wore both hats. Whenever there was a major change, we always also experienced the consequences for our teaching as lecturers. It’s good that the Vice Rectors work in the system of additional duties assumed on a voluntary basis so that we don’t make any unilateral or impractical decisions.

Vaterlaus: Yes – I’ve often wondered during discussions in the Rectorate how I would explain this to my colleagues in the department and how they would react. This is a good reality check. We sometimes soon reach an agreement during discussions in the Rectorate. But at the end of the day it also needs to fly!

Interview: Michael Walther